Jake – 00:00:01:
Someone will always do it better than you. They’ll be able to spend more money. They’ll have a better this, a better that. What they cannot copy is how you make people feel. Your story and your authenticity is the only thing that’s not copyable because they’re not going through that.
Paul – 00:00:17:
Welcome to the Time For A Reset Marketing Podcast: Insights from Global Brand Marketers, brought to you by CvE Marketing Consultancy. I’m your host, Paul Frampton-Calero, and in each episode, I dive deep into the minds of senior marketing leaders from around the world. Join me as we explore what they want to hit reset on an ever-changing landscape and uncover strategies that drive successful brand transformation. Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Time For A Reset. I am delighted to be joined by Jake. So Jake is the co-founder of Mid-Day Squares. He’s also, as you can probably see on the video, if you’re watching the video, the chief rainmaker, which I love that title. We might have to dig into that a little bit more in a second, Jake. So he’s chief rainmaker. He was, as I say, one of the original founders of the Good For You chocolate brand, which I believe, and it resonates with me because I follow a low FODMAP diet, is gluten-free, dairy-free, soy-free, and has lots of protein and fiber in it. So we’ll dig into that a little bit more in a second. But it’s also worth calling out that Jake has also not only been listed in the Forbes 30 Under 30, he is also a finalist for EY’s Entrepreneur of the Year. So I suggest that he’s pretty good at this entrepreneuring lark. So I’m really interested to dig into his entrepreneurial journey. But we always start in the first place, which is trying to understand, if you had a big orange button on the table, Jake, and you could change anything in marketing, what is it that you would change?
Jake – 00:01:40:
Paul, super fired up to be here. The one thing I think I would change is it’s a huge mindset shift. And the idea is actually moving away from more of the traditional selling in terms of marketing and moving more to storytelling and emotionally connecting consumers on a human level to build community. And I think that the future of all marketing is going to be who is the best storyteller and who is the most authentic. Because authenticity is something that creates relatability, which then creates trust. And I think that’s the basis of marketing.
Paul – 00:02:12:
I love that Jake. And I think given we’re almost like in the post-social, post-influencer generation, authenticity seems to be a really key thematic. And actually, some influencers that maybe weren’t quite so authentic have probably fallen by the wayside already, haven’t they?
Jake – 00:02:27:
Yeah, I think that, again, people just want to connect to real things. They want to be emotionally connected to something that relates to them, that means something to them. And I think brands have this unique opportunity for the first time in history. To do it, to actually connect at a deep level, not by spending boatloads of money, but by actually just sharing the real authentic story of your business. And it’s exciting times.
Paul – 00:02:51:
I guess that takes us quite nicely onto the origination and founding of Mid-Day Squares, because I believe you and some of your other family members founded it originally. And I’m imagining, given what I’ve read about the brands, that it was to be something that was a lot more real, a lot more authentic, and actually good for people, as well as, founded in community. So maybe you can just share a little bit with us about how you guys got there and why you launched it in the first place.
Jake – 00:03:16:
So amazing. Yeah, my sister, my brother-in-law are my partners. So we’re a family business, but we didn’t go into business because we’re family. We actually went into business because we complement each other’s skill sets tremendously. So what I’m great at, they may not be good at. What they’re great at, I’m not so good at. And the idea came about years before we actually launched the product. My sister was making a better for you chocolate bar for her husband because he had an addiction to eating higher sugar chocolates in the afternoon, and he would get these crashes loading. So she, being a foodie, made him a snack two and a half years prior to Mid-Day Squares even launching. And it was basically his afternoon snack that would give him energy and satiate him. And they did that for two and a half years until they read a report that showed that dark chocolate and vegan proteins were growing both very fast year over year. And that’s when they decided,and say hey, let’s commercialize this product that’s in front of us. It’s going to be a huge winner. The market is showing, the market trends and data is showing that this is what the consumer wants. And that’s when they came to me and they’re like, hey, do you want to join as our third founder and help blow up this business? And they said, you’re in charge of building community and making a fan base around the business. And going into the food space, there’s 40,000 products on a supermarket shelf. If you want to stick out, you can’t just have a great product. You actually need to have something more than that. And that’s where I came in and I started to tell my partners, let’s just document like a reality show how we’re going to build this business and let’s connect to the consumer at a human level. So when they go to the store, they don’t just see one chocolate bar on the shelf and 40,000 different products. They’re looking for it because they feel like they’re buying from a friend, a family or a neighbor. And that was the strategy. Build out loud, tell our story, but don’t talk about the chocolate bar.
Paul – 00:04:57:
Nice. I love that. I love that. And clearly authenticity right at the center of what you founded and how you brought the business to life. So Let’s go back to that point you made about authenticity. You talked about this shift from what most brands like the big CPG and kind of chocolate brands have known forever, which is you develop a product, you then work out how to get it to market, you spend a load of money on advertising and hope people will walk into a store. You obviously approached it in a very different way. And there are still quite a lot of brands that still follow the same recipe, or at least follow the same recipe with a bit of sprinkling of some of the new. So talk to us about why you think it’s so critical that marketers move to more authentic storytelling.
Jake – 00:05:38:
So yeah. And again, if you look at the grocery stores, supermarkets, there’s tons of commodities. So people were typically buying based on function, price, taste, whatever, let’s call it. And that’s great. And that’s super important. But at the end of the day, because we’re so connected on our phones today, we live in an attention economy where everything’s based on attention. And it’s not about me selling to you. It’s about me actually getting you to opt into what I want to sell to you. So meaning that you got to give me your attention so I can communicate with you. And if I were to sell to you and tell you that Mid-Day Squares is the best chocolate bar, it’s got six grams of protein, four grams of fiber, that would probably make you uninterested in terms of giving your attention. But if I showed you a milestone or a breakdown, let’s say a burnout that I had as an entrepreneur and how I got through it, that connects to you. So that gets your attention, your attention and says, I want to listen to this. So that way I can actually communicate with you as a brand to a human and actually sell to you over time and build that relationship. So when we went into the business, we knew that we had to make a good product, obviously with the right function, the taste and the price points, but we needed to give you way more than that in terms of emotionality. And that’s what we said. We said, let’s just take the strategy of building out loud. People were already doing it. Like someone like Elon Musk was building out loud in terms of building Tesla and it was working. And I just said, if we could evoke emotions, that will create this idea where we’ll have a relationship with the consumer and we’ll be able to stand out. And I think that brands today are moving slowly, more and more towards the emotional connection in terms of marketing, rather than the typical billboard TV ad sell you on the function or sell you on the price, because that’s irrelevant to the attention that they want to give you. So for us in a world where you could fast forward, block, unsubscribe, change the channel, delete with the power of your finger, you better be as a business, figure out a way to emotionally connect because otherwise they are not going to want to pay attention to you. They will unsubscribe to anything you give. And that’s gives the power back to consumers, not to businesses, and so now makes it not about spending money. It makes it about how well can you earn that right to tell them the story you want to tell them.
Paul – 00:07:43:
And gather attention. Yeah, you know, I like that. And I actually really like that building out loud concept. I think that’s really cool. And I’m sure things didn’t just immediately take off. There must’ve been some challenges at the beginning. So how did you guys get through or how did you almost hold your nerve while you waited for actually people to start buying and making the call to go, yeah, we’ll stock your, we’ll stock your chocolate brand.
Jake – 00:08:06:
Yeah. So at the beginning we were a DTC business only. So direct to consumer on our website and we were actually selling them as a sample. So you could buy one for 25 cents, try it and let us know if you like it. And I think that what ended up happening was while we were doing that, we were just documenting like a documentary, literally everything that was going on behind the scenes. So the stress of building the business, the hand delivering products, the emotionality of what was going on in the business, like breakdowns and therapy and consumers are watching this. They’re like, what is this? And we’re like, what is this? This is like Shark Tank meets like reality television, but authentic. And people start saying, I just want to be part of this. I want to buy and support this group. And that next thing we went from selling 10 bars a day to 50 bars a day, to making these in our condo kitchen, to having to move into a kitchen, commercial kitchen, because we almost got kicked out of the building. And we then built our own factory in Montreal and it was a progression over time, but people were so into the story that they wanted to just support the brand. And the way to support the brand was by the product, right? So then slowly we got one retailer, two retailers. Now we’re in about almost, I think 9,500 across North America, but now we’ll obviously have a media team and we create content all the time. But at the beginning, it was just share everything raw, unfiltered, and people liked it and wanted to just be a part of it.
Paul – 00:09:23:
You just alluded to the fact that it might have changed a little bit. Like you’ve obviously got a media team now. So obviously part of why that stood out is it was very different for the category. It’s not how the category behaved. But as that’s become, as more kind of brands have started to use TikTok and started to create content, has it become harder to stand out? Or do you still connect back to that authenticity still gets you the same, almost like the same currency that you had right at the beginning?
Jake – 00:09:50:
I think authenticity is something that’s never going to go away. I think humans have always craved from human nature, authenticity from their partners in life, their family, their friends. So it applies in the business world as well. So I don’t think it’s going to go out of style and it’s continued to work for us. Now, you’re right. There is a lot more content that’s put out there from both businesses and individuals. And a lot of the time, I believe that our content sticks out because it evokes an emotion. All the content we try to put out, it has to evoke an emotion, happiness, sadness, anger, inspiration. And if it does that, then typically we’ll break through the attention barrier, the attention influx of information, overload of information that’s out there. And it might not go viral in terms of tens of millions of views, but let’s say it gets a hundred thousand. We know that those hundred thousand views are quality. They’re meaningful. They actually do stuff. And it’s not like we’re doing trends all the time. We maybe do a trend once every six months, six months. We’re building content that means something to us that is emotionally charged. And I think that’s what allows us to consistently build a fan base, which is, we believe, a community. It’s not millions of people, but it’s hundreds of thousands of folks that actually love what we do and want to be part of what we’re doing and are on this journey with us. And they don’t just buy products. They shout about it. They get people to buy it. They’re like our external sales team. They’re brand evangelists. And I think that’s the future is focus more on your community. Give them, build with them, not focus on mass virality. Unfortunately, if I were to do a dance trend, it’s highly unlikely that you’re going to care about my brand. You might laugh at the content and say, oh, this looks funny, but the meaningfulness of it or the connectivity of it might not go far. Yes, it’s nice to go viral, but you’d rather hit the heart of a consumer where they care. They’re giving you their attention and intentionally. That’s way more powerful.
Paul – 00:11:37:
Yeah. And I hear you loud and clear that your content is about that emotional connection, about the realness, the authenticity. So why do you think like more traditional brands struggle so much with doing this? Is it the red? Is it the process that they’ve had in place for years that stops them actually creating more authentic marketing?
Jake – 00:11:55:
I think there’s too much red tape and bureaucracy, and there’s too much competition within people, within the organizations, meaning that if you take a risk, you’re losing. There’s an opportunity you might fail and somebody might take your promotion. And I think what ends up happening is it creates a box that prevents creativity or the idea of taking massive risks. Now there’s some organizations doing a better job at scale of doing that, but. I think that small businesses or medium-sized business have this unique opportunity of adaptability and the ability to pivot quickly and take risks and take advantage of that. That will propel them to challenge the traditional brands and disrupt this space quickly. And yeah, I think that you’re seeing larger businesses try to figure that out because at the end of the day, look again, it’s not about the amount of money you spend to get attention, how many billboards you have, TV ads. It’s actually how well you connect. So you got to take these risks. You got to take these bold decisions. Which take a long time within these organizations because of competition, because of the bureaucracy built into them.
Paul – 00:12:55:
No, I think you’re right, Jake. And your point about being able to be adaptable and agile and move fast, I think is what creates competitive advantage. And you’re right. It doesn’t mean you can’t do that as a large brand. It’s just way easy when you’re small and you don’t have as much bureaucracy. But there are large brands out there that do it. But they found a way around some of those barriers, I think.
Jake – 00:13:15:
Yeah, I’m a fan of the big companies actually inspired by them, the infrastructure that they built over the many years of work, the amount of people they employ, they do great. It’s just some of them are taking a little longer to get on that authentic train. And look, they don’t have the founding stories that the founders within the organization typically. They got to find their authentic story now. What is it now that they’re offering? What makes them special? What makes them? And I think that’s going to be a unique challenge for them over the next 10 years. But they better get on the train because these challenger brands are growing quickly and they’re getting scale quickly. And that’s all they need is the scale and the capital. And they could eventually over the next 10 years, get just very sizable businesses.
Paul – 00:13:56:
Yeah, that’s interesting. And like you mentioned virality and you mentioned you create a lot of social content. Now, of course, you don’t create it for virality. You create it to create that connection. Is there a particular piece of content that you guys are proud on TikTok or something you’ve done that you’re most proud of?
Jake – 00:14:13:
I think we’re most proud of the vulnerability and we see that it works on TikTok, it works on LinkedIn, it works on Instagram, it works on Meta. And when we post some content that really makes people feel something. Inside of them, whether that’s again, sadness, inspiration, aspiration, even anger, we noticed that drives a tremendous amount of content virality in terms of viewage, but also quality community building within it. So we noticed that sharing the vulnerability, but also sharing really exciting moments within an organization. Those two things work extremely well.
Paul – 00:14:46:
To your point, people like authenticity and other people, but they also like vulnerability. So why would it be any different given most businesses are made up of people, but we create these hard lines between people and corporate- Corporations, don’t we? And somehow our businesses can’t be vulnerable. They have to be together and they have to be structured. But actually, what connects with people is that things can go wrong and they like good stories and stories tend to have an arc. And the arc generally means that things don’t always go well. They might start well and then they go wrong and then they get back to a good place. But that’s what a good story is, right? It has a beginning and middle and an end ultimately.
Jake – 00:15:23:
Yeah. I think that what’s super important, Paul, is for your listeners listening is at the end of the day, most products out there, other than the really big innovations that are patented or really unique new things that are breakthroughs, which are very rare in my opinion, the one thing that it is, is we are commodities that people can copy. Someone will always do it better than you. They’ll be able to spend more money. They’ll have a better this, a better that. What they cannot copy is how you make people feel. Your story and your authenticity is the only thing that’s not copyable because they’re not going through that. So why don’t we lean into that more as individuals or brands? That’s a big thing.
Paul – 00:15:59:
Yeah, that’s a great message for the listeners. I think you’re right. You obviously got picked out in the Forbes 30 Under 30 in the food and drink category, and you’ve been shortlisted for the Entrepreneur of the Year Awards, the EY Awards, I believe. What is it, without blowing your own trumpet, what is it that you think people identified in your journey or your journey as a founder that stood out?
Jake – 00:16:19:
I appreciate this question because it’s not about necessarily us being the biggest business or the most successful in quotations. I think for us, what they noticed or they took spotlight to was the idea that we are taking our own path, we’re beating to our own drum, meaning that we are okay to be unapologetically ourselves as we build this business. And that’s inspiring a completely new generation of entrepreneurs to take the really big risks in themselves and not follow herd mentality or follow the typical way of doing things. So I think that’s been a huge reason why we’ve been spotlighted in a lot of these different accolades is because of that. And I’m grateful for it because at the end of the day, that’s my mission is really to go out there and… Yes, build the next biggest chocolate snack company. That’s great. Don’t get me wrong. But that’s a chapter in my life. The real big thing I’m trying to do is go out there, spread good energy every day, try to spread good energy every day, make people feel something and show the world that you win by investing in you and being yourself every day. And if I could do that by building a, hopefully a very large chocolate snacking company in a very old school industry, then it will prove that anyone could do it in anything. But you got to believe in yourself.
Paul – 00:17:24:
Yeah, that’s great. I think that’s a phenomenal message for anybody listening, particularly in marketing circles. I think… Everything’s always been glossy and people are expected to show up a certain way and look a certain way and behave a certain way. I think it’s really important that people are reminded that it’s you being you that is what stands out. I think that’s not new, but a very powerful message for people to hear.
Jake – 00:17:46:
Yeah, it’s not new. It’s definitely not new, but you’re right. It’s just people need to show it more and they need to be out there. And I think that like a great example, Paul, is we’re sitting in a podcast right now, you and I in different parts of the world, but I’m in Montreal, Canada, and it’s freezing here. It’s like negative 10 degrees today, Celsius or negative 12. And I’m wearing shorts because I like wearing shorts in the winter, but I’m going on a meeting after this and I don’t care. I’m going to show up in the shorts and I don’t give a shit. No offense to anybody. It’s who I am. And if someone doesn’t like that, that’s them. That’s not on me. I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but that’s what I’m trying to show the world is you got to just be fired up by yourself and what you’re doing and be a kind person as you’re doing it, but be you.
Paul – 00:18:24:
Now, I like that example. And it is a board meeting, actually, I believe, Jake. So not only are you going to a meeting in shorts, you’re going to a board meeting in shorts, which is pretty cool. And it’s minus 10.
Jake – 00:18:33:
Yeah.
Paul – 00:18:33:
You also have the title chief rainmaker. And I could guess what that means, but I’d love you to unpack what rainmaking is about and why you wanted to have that as a title rather than maybe some of the more tired and normal kind of titles that people have.
Jake – 00:18:47:
I like that. Tired. Yeah. When we started this business, it was my sister, my brother-in-law and I, and we founded it together. And my sister and brother-in-law were co-CEOs. So they had the big title and I thought I needed a big title too. So I said, I’m going to be a CMO. The chief marketing officer. And I did a horrible job, bro. I knew I wasn’t going to do a good job, but I did because I felt that’s the expectation. I owned 33% of the business at the time. I got to have a really big role. So I did it. And for six to eight months, I was failing. People were quitting. I was doing a horrible job. I was a bad manager. But I noticed during that time what I was really good at was actually getting people to be excited about something like build community and make friends. I was really good at making relationships with retailers, with potential investors, media. And I started to realize that. That’s really what I’m good at. That’s my strength is making friends for our business. So why am I not investing in that 24-7? So I decided to step down from chief marketing officer. And I started to become managed because I wanted to be managed because I was disorganized and I wasn’t a good manager. And I said, I want to play to my strengths, which is just go out there and make friends for the brand, build the network, and bring in as much opportunity to the organization as possible. And what that meant was I’d go out and give speeches, go do media, go do all this hype keynotes, and then make friends with these people. And bring them back to our team for sales, marketing, finance, or media. And that became my job is just friends. So that’s what a rainmaker is. And I realized that the only reason why I didn’t step down before from the CMO was because my ego was in the way. And I was like, oh, I need to do this because of that. And thank God I got rid of that, man. That was the worst thing in the world. So anyone listening to it is play to your strengths, not your weaknesses, because you’ll be a lot happier and a lot more efficient and optimized.
Paul – 00:20:29:
Well, firstly, I love the candor and honesty and vulnerability in sharing that story, because I’m sure there are a lot of people that feel they have imposter syndrome, yet they stick in the job because they think they have to stick in the job rather than facing up to the reality that maybe that job isn’t the right job for them. So I love you telling that story first off. The second kind of linked question I have is, what do you think today’s kind of chief marketing kind of officer actually should look like? Frankly, whether it’s chief marketing or chief rainmaker, because to me, actually, a lot of what you described is a version between the CMO and a chief revenue officer. It’s just that you look at it in a very different way. It’s like, actually, I’m just building friendships and connections and bringing opportunity. And rather than you’re the growth guy or you’re the revenue guy, but there are some similarities and familiarities there. So tell me what you think businesses need to grow. Maybe I’ll ask it like that. What do businesses need to grow? Maybe it isn’t the CMO. Maybe it’s something different, and maybe it’s what you articulated.
Jake – 00:21:25:
I think that there needs to be someone that holds everyone accountable at the top from a vision perspective and just accountability. But I think underneath that, I think that marketing teams need to have a chief storyteller. So that’s someone that directs the story. And then they need a performance team. So separate is the performance marketing that focuses on, obviously, specifically revenue targets. So you have storyteller and community. That’s one side. And then revenue is the other side. And then they operate under, you want to call it a CMO, that’s great or whatever. But the CMO is simply just a vision. It’s a vision and accountability officer. That’s all it is. And I think that underneath that is really the nitty gritty folks that, again, tell the story in the community and build that community. And then the other side acquires new customers, let’s call it, and focuses on more of that angle of selling.
Paul – 00:22:13:
So Jake, not only, obviously, you’re one of the founders, but you just told us the story about how you were originally CMO and then became Rainmaker. So I’d love you to maybe just unpack what you think the best of being a Rainmaker versus actually being a CMO. And you were just starting to talk about kind of brand team, like a community content team versus a performance team. A lot of big brands kind of silo those things entirely. I’m just interested in, do you guys join those things up or do you deliberately keep them quite independent from each other?
Jake – 00:22:42:
So we definitely have them independent. I think that they, look, the brand community team will build content for the performance team to use, but the performance team’s mission is very different than the brand community team. The brand community team really focuses on humanization, that community built, doing those things. Now, I think if you want to have a successful Rainmaker in an organization, I think my piece of advice is they need to not have an ROI. And it’s going to sound weird, but when you’re trying to make friends, if you have an ROI, you have an agenda, you’re trying to get something out of somebody. So there’s a bit of an inauthenticity there, right? When I go travel to New York, to Texas, to Florida, to California, anywhere to go meet people, I actually don’t care if something happens for me. What I care about is, can I connect with this person at a deeper level? And if I can, then over time, if we get to work together on whether it’s you’re an investor in our company eventually, or you write an article on us, then that’s great. But if it doesn’t happen, it’s fine either way. I have a new friend in a new city, which then can introduce me to another person. And that’s what a successful Rainmaker does is my return on investment might come in four years from now, which will be an acquisition that comes through for my company that I met on a trip that I was making friends with this person. And next thing, we get an extra 50 million out of the deal because of that. So that’s what the key is, is the ROI has to be free spirited from the Rainmaker. It almost needs to be an independent person from the organization that is just going out there every day and making friends and running whatever they want to run, because that allows someone to be themselves without having that agenda.
Paul – 00:24:13:
Interesting. Yeah, it must be pretty empowering to be able to do that. And I can see to your point, I can see how if everybody’s always going to a meeting with somebody that’s got an agenda and they have an agenda, then do those two agendas ever come together? I think you’re right that actually every organization could benefit from some of that sprinkle dust of a Rainmaker, even if it’s not someone that’s permanent staff or 100% focused on that business. I feel like actually there’s something in that, which is you’ve got to be out there and having authentic conversations in order for things to come towards you. It’s just the kind of way of manifesting, isn’t it? The way of law of attraction to some extent.
Jake – 00:24:51:
100%. 100%.
Paul – 00:24:52:
So we talked a little bit ago and you brought it up actually, Jake, about, the importance of vulnerability in your brand and it being a core value for the brand. And it sounds like for you as well. So what I’d love to do, given you’ve been Forbes 30 Under 30, and as we said, you’re also being called out as a kind of very effective entrepreneur. A lot of people are probably sitting here listening going, well, Jake’s done it all at a young age. He’s very successful, but I’m sure there are a ton of things that you’re still working on and are a work in progress. So would you mind just being vulnerable for the listeners and beyond what you shared about standing down as the CMO, give some advice to people listening?
Jake – 00:25:26:
A hundred percent. So I’ve struggled with a bit of feeling of loneliness and a bit of depression at times throughout this journey. I’ve had burnout, which was a horrible thing that lasted 30, 40 days last year and a half ago. And that changed my perspective on everything and taking care of myself and focusing on avoiding the unhealthy lifestyle, the danger of literally running your body down to the ground to build whatever you’re building. And I still believe I’m giving a hundred plus percent every day in what you’re doing, but I’m very careful not getting a burnout again. And also working on just being excited, even though the moments are really tough and things take a lot of time in business. You want to just sometimes chase things because you hear that person’s successful or this business is doing that and yours is taking a little longer. That’s all good. That’s all noise. You block that out and you’ll feel a lot better. And I think that’s something I went through is instead of feeling all this pressure from everything around me, I started just be excited about what I was doing, that it’s a privilege to be on the journey of, even if it’s painful at times and lonely, it’s a privilege to be able to build something special, that I believe is special at least. And if it takes a little bit longer than the person next to us, so be it. Everyone’s trying to chase ending or a summit rather than trying to enjoy the process of being on this journey, which is something very unique. Everyone has their own unique journey and we all want someone else’s. So I think that trying to figure out how to enjoy your own is super critical to sustaining life and enjoying the game of life. And your business doesn’t define you. I think that’s another one, which I used to think it did. And that brought me to a crisis. And identity crisis. And now I’ve just come to understand that my business is just part of my current chapter of the book I’m writing. It’s not the full book.
Paul – 00:27:04:
Nice. Thank you for sharing that, Jake. I think there’s a lot of good messages in there for people. And ultimately we have to be ourselves, as you’ve said, and we all are particularly in the marketing and advertising industry. Everybody and everything looks so perfect from the outside, but you never know what’s really going on under the hood or inside someone’s head. So I love that the reminder of making sure that, actually you stay true to yourself. And you’ve also encouraged us to make sure that people are authentic in terms of what they do and the journey they follow, but also how they think about their own marketing. So I’ve really enjoyed this conversation. And it’s the message that you’re trying to preach to the world, I think has been very clear today. And one that I think a lot of people will learn from and appreciate. So thank you so much for making the time. I’m sure you’re a busy man making new friends every few hours. Thank you for making the time to stop by today.
Jake – 00:27:52:
Paul, I appreciate you. New friend now, hopefully for life.
Paul – 00:27:56:
And that’s a wrap for this episode of the Time For A Reset Marketing Podcast: Insights from Global Brand Marketers, brought to you by CvE Marketing Consultancy. I’ve been your host, Paul Frampton-Calero, and I hope the insights shared today will help you reset and refine your strategies for successful brand transformation. We’d love to hear from you. If you’re enjoying Time For A Reset, please do leave us a comment or a review on your preferred platform and subscribe to be the first to know when a new episode drops. See you next time as I chat with another senior marketing leader. See you soon. Bye.
